Hello everyone! This will be our final discussion regarding Of Mice and Men. Please comment on any aspect of the novel. Your participation is appreciated!
First of all let me say that I was not expecting that ending. I knew that Lennie would get in trouble and I figured someone would want to hurt him, but I never suspected that it would be George who killed him. The way George was describing the farm to Lennie right before he pulled the trigger was very sad. I think the overall purpose of the novel, or one of the themes, is that the 'American dream' cannot be achieved. The world is not a perfect place, and this story illustrates how our lives can take a turn for the worst rather than end up happily. This 'happily ever after' notion is simply unattainable. I also noticed that for the most part women in this story were not portrayed in a good light. Curley's wife was obviously not shown any respect and the men often talk of visiting brothels. It seems to suggest that women are a cause of unhappiness. I find it interesting how the author chose to physically describe Lennie. He made him a big, strong, supposedly powerful man. But this is only in physical strength. This implies that physical strength has no importance but it is the strength of the mind that drives you through life.
I have to say I wasn't expecting that ending either, but if I think about it now, Steinbeck left many hints in the rest of the novel. While there were many hints to a bad ending, I think the death of Candy's old dog foreshadows Lennie's death most closely. In the second section we read, Carlson describes the old dog as being no good to Candy and no good for himself either. This is similar to how Lennie causes a lot of trouble for George and how Lennie's excessive strength gets him into trouble as well. Candy tries to defends his old dog by saying he has had the dog since it was a young pup and even though it is not immediately visible, the dog was one of the best sheep dogs he has ever seen. This mirrors Lennie's relationship with George since they have known each other for a long time and Lennie also has great abilities as a worker despite his lack of intelligence. One of the more obvious similarities is the method of death which is the bullet to the back of the head. In both cases, this is meant to put the victim out of their misery. For the dog, this is his inability to eat, see or walk without pain and for Lennie, it is his imaginary punishment and the disappointment from the people he cares about. More generally, I think it's amazing how Steinbeck brings the ending back to the Salinas River and describes the life in that clearing until it suddenly dies down again. I think of this as symbolizing the brief hope that the men had of buying their own land which is now being crushed.
now that george has a new set of friends he no longer needs lennie for company. before he shoots lennie he talks of the perfect ranch to give lennie a picture of happiness before he dies. j why do you think the ending is 'amazing'? i can understand the reason george made the decision to kill lennie but one still feels shocked that he would kill his best friends. overall the book was simple and short but makes the reader think of a lot of issues. it was a powerful book.
Oops, I didn't mean amazing in a good way. I meant amazing as in the ending was very powerful emotionally. It was a very tragic ending and as soon as George pulled out Carlson's Luger, we knew that Lennie was going to die. Steinbeck didn't rush the ending though. It played out very slowly but so much was happening at the same time. We alternated between the struggles George was facing, the dream land that Lennie was imagining and the voices of the other men approaching. It's sad to read, but we can see why George does it. I don't really think that George decides to kill Lennie because he doesn't need his company anymore though. George keeps trying to convince himself that maybe the other guys won't hurt Lennie, but Slim helps him realize that it would be difficult for them to keep Curley from shooting him. George also knows that it wouldn't be very good to have Lennie locked up either. This could be evidence that George knows that what Lennie did was wrong, but he also wants to protect Lennie because he knows Lennie didn't have the intention to kill Curley's wife. On the other hand, before George has this conversation with Slim, he had already taken Carlson's Luger. I can't really think of another reason why George would take the pistol if he didn't intend on using it again Lennie. It is possible that he was planning on using the pistol to protect Lennie, but this would be hard to imagine since he didn't want to be around the barn when Candy told the others because he was afraid the other men would think he played a part in Curley's wife's death. I think I might just be hoping that George didn't kill Lennie because he replaced his company. Anyone else have any thoughts about this?
I don't think the only reason George killed Lennie was because he had found other men with whom he felt accepted. But it could certainly be a factor. I think he wanted to protect Lennie and did so by killing him quickly, in a way that he wouldn't even feel it. Lennie would be thinking about the farm and then...nothing. If Curley or another man had found Lennie first they could have tortured him or yelled at him and George knew that Lennie would die sad and he didn't want this. I think having the company though made George realize that Lennie would never fit in and would always get into trouble and killing him would be the only way to protect him.
5 comments:
First of all let me say that I was not expecting that ending. I knew that Lennie would get in trouble and I figured someone would want to hurt him, but I never suspected that it would be George who killed him. The way George was describing the farm to Lennie right before he pulled the trigger was very sad. I think the overall purpose of the novel, or one of the themes, is that the 'American dream' cannot be achieved. The world is not a perfect place, and this story illustrates how our lives can take a turn for the worst rather than end up happily. This 'happily ever after' notion is simply unattainable. I also noticed that for the most part women in this story were not portrayed in a good light. Curley's wife was obviously not shown any respect and the men often talk of visiting brothels. It seems to suggest that women are a cause of unhappiness. I find it interesting how the author chose to physically describe Lennie. He made him a big, strong, supposedly powerful man. But this is only in physical strength. This implies that physical strength has no importance but it is the strength of the mind that drives you through life.
I have to say I wasn't expecting that ending either, but if I think about it now, Steinbeck left many hints in the rest of the novel. While there were many hints to a bad ending, I think the death of Candy's old dog foreshadows Lennie's death most closely. In the second section we read, Carlson describes the old dog as being no good to Candy and no good for himself either. This is similar to how Lennie causes a lot of trouble for George and how Lennie's excessive strength gets him into trouble as well. Candy tries to defends his old dog by saying he has had the dog since it was a young pup and even though it is not immediately visible, the dog was one of the best sheep dogs he has ever seen. This mirrors Lennie's relationship with George since they have known each other for a long time and Lennie also has great abilities as a worker despite his lack of intelligence. One of the more obvious similarities is the method of death which is the bullet to the back of the head. In both cases, this is meant to put the victim out of their misery. For the dog, this is his inability to eat, see or walk without pain and for Lennie, it is his imaginary punishment and the disappointment from the people he cares about.
More generally, I think it's amazing how Steinbeck brings the ending back to the Salinas River and describes the life in that clearing until it suddenly dies down again. I think of this as symbolizing the brief hope that the men had of buying their own land which is now being crushed.
now that george has a new set of friends he no longer needs lennie for company. before he shoots lennie he talks of the perfect ranch to give lennie a picture of happiness before he dies. j why do you think the ending is 'amazing'?
i can understand the reason george made the decision to kill lennie but one still feels shocked that he would kill his best friends. overall the book was simple and short but makes the reader think of a lot of issues. it was a powerful book.
Oops, I didn't mean amazing in a good way. I meant amazing as in the ending was very powerful emotionally. It was a very tragic ending and as soon as George pulled out Carlson's Luger, we knew that Lennie was going to die. Steinbeck didn't rush the ending though. It played out very slowly but so much was happening at the same time. We alternated between the struggles George was facing, the dream land that Lennie was imagining and the voices of the other men approaching. It's sad to read, but we can see why George does it. I don't really think that George decides to kill Lennie because he doesn't need his company anymore though. George keeps trying to convince himself that maybe the other guys won't hurt Lennie, but Slim helps him realize that it would be difficult for them to keep Curley from shooting him. George also knows that it wouldn't be very good to have Lennie locked up either. This could be evidence that George knows that what Lennie did was wrong, but he also wants to protect Lennie because he knows Lennie didn't have the intention to kill Curley's wife. On the other hand, before George has this conversation with Slim, he had already taken Carlson's Luger. I can't really think of another reason why George would take the pistol if he didn't intend on using it again Lennie. It is possible that he was planning on using the pistol to protect Lennie, but this would be hard to imagine since he didn't want to be around the barn when Candy told the others because he was afraid the other men would think he played a part in Curley's wife's death.
I think I might just be hoping that George didn't kill Lennie because he replaced his company. Anyone else have any thoughts about this?
I don't think the only reason George killed Lennie was because he had found other men with whom he felt accepted. But it could certainly be a factor. I think he wanted to protect Lennie and did so by killing him quickly, in a way that he wouldn't even feel it. Lennie would be thinking about the farm and then...nothing. If Curley or another man had found Lennie first they could have tortured him or yelled at him and George knew that Lennie would die sad and he didn't want this. I think having the company though made George realize that Lennie would never fit in and would always get into trouble and killing him would be the only way to protect him.
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